Kissaki
Hi there :)
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Now that I’ve got the urge to play around with my analogue SLR again, I thought, why not dive a bit deeper into it? I’d always put off developing my own film because I found the initial investment (equipment/chemicals) a bit of a hurdle – and since I can’t scan, I’d have to send the films off anyway.
Curiosity has now got the better of me, though, and my starter kit for negative development should be on its way (@Fotoimpex? ;) ).
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But as I’m also keen to be able to make my own prints, I’m wondering just how big the next hurdle is? As a student, money’s always tight and that little developing kit was quite pricey for me, so I don’t expect to be able to get started with that in the next few months. But just for guidance and planning, what’s needed and what sort of costs should I expect for second-hand equipment?
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By the way, this is all for 35mm for now. I’d really love to shoot and develop medium format at some point, but that’s still a long way off.
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Thanks in advance for your input :)
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*edit*
Oh, and roughly how much space do I need to allow for? Mainly for the enlarger, as that’s probably the hardest thing to ‘accommodate’.
Franco
The best thing to do is to find someone (perhaps here on the forum) who can show you how to print. It’s easier than it looks at first to achieve your first presentable results. When it comes to darkroom equipment, you should focus on the essentials. You shouldn’t skimp on the enlarger lens or proper darkroom lighting. As for photographic paper, modern PE multi-contrast papers are a good choice.
There’s space even in the smallest of homes; you can set up your developing trays above the bath or shower, and depending on the size of the bathroom, you can also set up your enlarger there. If you put a bit of effort into it, you can organise your darkroom so that it’s fully operational or packed away again in less than half an hour. My enlarger, for example, is in the storage cupboard and the hallway, and the bathroom is darkened when I’m working on photos.
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When it comes to photochemistry, definitely stick to tried-and-tested materials to start with – no esoteric miracle gadgets
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A large number of complete darkroom kits are sold on eBay for very little money.
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Best regards, Thorsten
jonny
For a hundred euros, you should be able to put together a complete set of second-hand beginner’s equipment for a positive-process darkroom. But before you start thinking about buying equipment such as enlargers and so on, you need to sort out the space situation.
If you tell us which room you’ve got in mind for enlarging and making prints, we can certainly give you a few tips on set-up and equipment.
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If you live in a larger town or city, there may also be the option of using a public darkroom (run by clubs, organisations, etc.) to start with, or taking a relevant course. You can check
http://www.localdarkroom.com to see if there’s anything like this in your area. The database isn’t exhaustive, of course, so be sure to ask around and have a look locally as well.
wosis123
Where do you live?
I’m in Ludwigshafen am Rhein and belong to a photography club with its own darkroom; we also run courses in partnership with the adult education centre. If you’re interested and/or live nearby, just get in touch.
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Hendrik
Kissaki
I live in Lüneburg, near Hamburg. I’ve already written to the universities in the city (I’m a student in Hamburg) to ask if I could use their darkrooms, but I haven’t received a reply yet.
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I’d use my hallway for darkroom development as it has no windows and the doors could easily be made light-tight with two or three black bin bags. I’d probably dry the prints in the bathroom right next door.
As for a work surface, I’d only have a deep cupboard, which is why I asked about the dimensions – I’m not sure if an enlarger would fit in there comfortably. If necessary, I could place the trays on the left and right of the cupboard or laundry basket.
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Is the chemical temperature just as important for printing as it is for development? Neither room has heating. I’ve now ordered an aquarium heating element for the negatives so I can bring the mixtures up to temperature in a water bath, but I’m not sure if that will work for photo trays.
wosis123
The temperature isn't really a big deal when it comes to printing; I'd say anything between 18 and 22 degrees is fine. If it gets colder, extend the processing time according to the developer's instructions.
Urnes
You don’t need an aquarium heater for negative development, though. It’s enough to heat the developer in a water bath (hot tap water will do) to 20 degrees. The stop bath and fixer shouldn’t differ by more than 3 or 4 degrees from that. You can then work as the temperature drops.
You can do the same for positives. For long sessions, you can use the heater, but again in a water bath – i.e. bowl within a bowl.
Regards, Sven.
Kissaki
My film developing starter kit has now arrived and is settling in nicely in its new home; I’ve also almost finished shooting my first roll of film (the first one I’m developing myself), which has got me wondering: what’s the best way to get the film out of the canister at the end?
bernhardmangelsgmxde
Financially speaking, it’s doable – even for students on a tight budget. But it’s not free. I’d say you can get quite a long way on an average of €20 a month; you can, of course, spend more, but especially at the start (until your hardware is complete), you shouldn’t expect to get by on much less for the first year or two (it is possible, but especially if you’re not yet very familiar with the subject, you can sometimes get it wrong when buying equipment, and sometimes you just have bad luck...).
Second-hand lab equipment – especially compared to what new items used to cost – can sometimes be had very cheaply. If you’re a bit restrained with the paper size at the start and make an effort, the costs for consumables can also remain very manageable. You could also spend two hours in the shop and only process 5–6 sheets of 10x15cm paper. That would cost a euro or so, so even for people on a low income, the time factor is probably more decisive. But if you use 24x30cm as your standard format, and/or produce a lot of rejects (which I’d factor in at the start), it can of course get more expensive. When it comes to paper and developer, I’d definitely make sure to use fresh materials to begin with.
Temperature: Not particularly critical for the positive process; I’d aim for at least 18°C to start with, but the flat won’t be any colder than that anyway.
Space: There are people who have darkrooms in 1m² spaces, so where there’s a will, there’s a way – be inventive, come up with something and so on. Darkness, space for an enlarger and a few trays, that’s all you need. There are larger and smaller enlargers; you can find out.
Getting the film out of the cassette: Surely there must be instructions for that, right?
Morte
You’ll need a black bag and a bottle opener for crown caps. Or you can do it in pitch darkness in the darkroom. No red light!
Kissaki
I’d aim for at least 18°C to start with, but the flat won’t get any colder than that anyway
I left my water bath tray standing for a few hours and the temperature there was then around 15°.
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As for getting it out of the cassette, I’ve so far seen instructions involving double-sided tape, plain water and various keys; I was actually interested to hear what you lot recommend. Just stick a screwdriver in there and press hard?
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As for consumables, I’m not someone who shoots loads of film all the time. On average, I shoot maybe one roll of film every two months, perhaps a bit more in the summer. However, I reckon I’ll be playing around with it a bit more in the near future :)
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*edit*
Right then, I’ll give that a go with a bottle opener.
Franco
You can remove the film strip from the cassette in no time at all using a film picker, in daylight. Then you wind the film onto the reel, in the dark, and cut it off at the end.
Urnes
If you don’t pull the film all the way back into the cassette when rewinding, you won’t have this problem at all. You’ll clearly hear a click when the film jumps off the reel. Then you take it out and the opening credits are still on the reel. It’s only 10–15 cm to the first frame anyway. Now you can tear off the tab straight across, so you’ll know straight away which film has undergone exposure and which hasn’t. So if you ever find yourself in the awkward situation of having to run more than one film through, or if you’ve got several films lying around at home waiting to be developed.
Regards, Sven.
bernhardmangelsgmxde
I don’t use a rewinder or ‘film picker’ – I’ve got some Chinese one that does the job.
I recently fetched the developer from the cellar, which was 13°C, and used it in a 18°C bath after about half an hour. In my basement darkroom, I haven’t switched on the heating panels at 15°C (or thereabouts) either. It actually worked fine for me – just a slightly longer development time – but I wouldn’t do that, especially at the start, because it’s a potential source of error. In a darkroom in a lived-in flat, this isn’t usually a problem unless you’re someone who refuses to use heating at all.
TR
You can also simply open a 35mm cassette with your fingers by placing two of them where the film used to be – in the dark, of course.
Kissaki
So, at first glance, my first roll of HP5+ has come out of the can looking pretty good :)
We’ll have to see if it still looks OK when printed large...
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But back to the enlarger:
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Do colour enlargers also work for B&W?
Can you retrofit ones for 35mm to medium format?
What difference does it make whether it’s 1:2.8 or, say, 1:4.5 on an enlarger? Isn’t the size determined by the height of the column?
Franco
Yes, you can use colour enlargers for black-and-white photography. However, you should make sure you have the correct settings for multigrade paper so that you can make the most of these papers.
Whether you can retrofit an enlarger depends on the model. You may need a different condenser or a comparable light source. You’ll also need a suitable lens.
By 1:2.8, do you mean the aperture on the lens? That’s independent of the enlargement. Lenses used for 35mm are usually slightly faster, but this offers no advantage in terms of quality. The magnification is, of course, adjusted via the column, but medium-format lenses have a different focal length to 35mm enlargement lenses. With medium-format enlargements, you therefore have a different height on the enlarger, and the reproduction scale is also different, assuming the paper size remains the same.
Wolf_XL
...Above all, I’d advise you to simply get hold of a good book on the subject and take your time to get to grips with the basics. Your current approach is more along the lines of ‘trial and error’, and you run the risk of losing interest very quickly at some point. What’s more, by taking a targeted approach, you’ll save a lot of time and materials...
Kissaki
Your current approach is more along the lines of 'trial and error'
Pretty much exactly that :)
Can you give me a good recommendation?
TR
There’s been
a new book out for a while now, aimed at beginners.
If you want to do more than just make copies from the negative later on, you might want to check out
my book review. :spudnikwaving:
