pikespeak
Hello,
I still have a few hundred metres of old Orwo MA8 film that I’d like to try out.
In old literature, I’ve found that Orwo F43 was a suitable developer at the time, as well as Orwo MH28 and Orwo F199.
According to my research, F43 is identical to Agfa Final.
Does anyone know of a comparable alternative to any of the developers mentioned? Or does anyone have experience using them in combination with other developers?
Please no fundamental discussion about the use of old film stock; I don’t have high expectations of the result myself, but I’d like to minimise the uncertainty regarding the developer.
Many thanks, Regards
HenningH
I read somewhere – I can’t find the source at the moment – that Final was Agfa’s equivalent of ID-11 and D76.
However, the formula for F19 appears to match that of ID-11; F43 is similar, but still contains acetate.
MH28 was a universal metol-hydroquinone developer, which apparently produced quite a coarse grain.
F199 was a fixer or single-bath developer.
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If you’ve got enough film to spare, I’d go for D76 or ID-11 to test.
AntiLynd
You know enough about developers now :) Another interesting question would be exactly what sort of film this is. As far as I know, the MA8 is a microphotography film with a speed of 8° DIN (or whatever’s left of it). Typical use: line art reproduction. So be prepared for the fact that if you treat it as normal film using a D76-type developer, you’ll end up with images lacking any grey tones between black and white.
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You can, of course, justify this as a personal touch. Alternatively, look for a developer specifically designed to produce negatives with normal contrast when used with a document film. But then the question arises: why not just use a standard film for normal results with normal processing, ideally fairly fresh from the factory and from a manufacturer you can expect to still be in business by the time you’ve got your workflow sorted?
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Good luck
Nils
pikespeak
@Henning, thanks for that,
@ AntiLynd, as I asked, I wanted to avoid this discussion! Perhaps you didn’t read my post to the end.
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I’m also aware of what sort of film this is. It’s perfectly suitable for my intended use – provided it still works. I don’t need mid-tones, but I do need sharp contrast.
For all other applications, I have a suitable film for each, which is why I use several cameras; I’m not keen on reeling half-rolls of film back and forth.
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According to my research, the MA8 is a further development of the DK films. I don’t know if it was available in normal shops. All the formats I’m aware of are always 35mm in 5, 30 or 90 metres. It was also available unperforated. I’ve never seen 35mm cassettes for sale. Apparently, the MA8 was primarily used by the Stasi. The development recipes I’ve been able to find naturally only refer to Orwo developers: undiluted in F43 for 4–8 minutes for normal to strong gradient; in MH28 1+4 for 3–4 minutes for strong to steep gradient; and in F199 for 2 minutes, though at 25°C and for normal to strong gradient.
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It would be helpful for me to know which developer currently available delivers the same or better results under otherwise optimal conditions as those mentioned. Or rather, I was hoping that someone has already had experience with this.
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I was hoping that ADOX might have a successor to Final; that would be worth a try.
HenningH
Have you read
that Hungarian website?
In the end, it was simply (alongside Rodinal) Agfa’s run-of-the-mill developer. As I’ve already said, I wouldn’t hold out any hope of finding a replica, but would just use another standard developer.
The time specification of 4–8 minutes isn’t particularly precise anyway, and the film is old, so you’ll have to test it out anyway.
AntiLynd
@pikespeak,
let’s put it this way: I was a bit too quick to focus too much on one particular point... sorry!
PS:
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Orwo MH28:
Water 750ml
Metol 1.7g
Sodium sulphite 35g
Hydroquinone 6g
Sodium carbonate 40g
Potassium bromide 1g
Water to 1000ml
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Agfa Final:
Metol 4g
Sodium sulphite 62.5g
Hydroquinone 4g
Sodium carbonate 3.2g
Potassium bromide 0.5g
tomsand
A fine-grain developer is not the same as an ultra-fine-grain developer
The latter was also referred to as an ultra-fine-grain developer.
Examples: A49, Microdol, Perceptol
Examples of fine-grain developers: Microphen, Xtol, etc.
Orwo F43 (Agfa Final) is a standard metol-hydroquinone developer, as are D76, ID11 and Orwo 19. You have to like it... Suitable for medium and large formats; for 35mm, only recommended for those who prefer a coarse grain. Highlight detail is also rather poor. Beware of overdevelopment!
HenningH
Well, the Metol-hydroquinone-borax developers aren’t actually that coarse-grained. I find Microphen much harsher.
tomsand
It’s all relative. Microphen is pre-pushed, so you mustn’t overdevelop with it under any circumstances. But apart from that, with phenidone as the developing agent, it is certainly a fine-grain developer.
jochen53
Hello,
If you’re using microfilm and want strong contrast, you probably don’t need a fine grain developer at all. Firstly, the film is already very fine grain, and secondly, you can’t see any grain in the black areas anyway.
